Twin Flash or Two Flashes?

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MonarchzMan
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Twin Flash or Two Flashes?

Post by MonarchzMan »

As I am taking stock in what I should get to switch over to Canon, I am undecided as to what I should invest money on for flashes. For the moment of argument, we'll say that I'm going to get the 5D Mark III (still up in the air about spending that much on a body...), and if that is the case, I will need a flash as it has none.

Most of my photography is macro, and I had originally thought of getting a twin flash, but I've been wondering if it would be better to get two external flashes and a rig to set them up as a twin flash with a wireless trigger. Then I could use them as a twin flash or as external flashes. Has anyone had experience with doing this? How does it work for macro photography? My biggest concern would be overshooting the mark since I figure I'll use a 100mm lens, so most of my subjects (little frogs and insects, mostly) would be within a foot or so of the lens.

Thoughts?
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chrish
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Re: Twin Flash or Two Flashes?

Post by chrish »

I have used two separate flashes triggered wirelessly for macro. The problem is the physical manipulation of the flashes and the bracket. No matter how well designed the flash bracket is, it is still cumbersome. And you are correct, it can be tricky to get the light exactly where you want it, although the subject distance with a 100mm lens is enough to make it doable.

The macro flash rigs are easier to use for this sort of thing, but you sacrifice the power of a larger flash. Then again, for macro work you don't need much power.

I'm curious, why would you buy a Full Frame camera for macro work?
Sure the 5d series give outstanding high ISO performance and low pixel densities, particularly at high ISO. But the pixel densities of lower resolution APS-C camera bodies is almost as good as long as you aren't printing billboard sized prints. And since you are using flash, you aren't going to need ISO 3200 for your shots.
With the smaller sensors you get the the 1.6x crop (magnification) bonus plus you are taking pictures with the sharpest part of your lenses.

You could get an outstanding camera to do the same job for 1/2 or 2/3 the price and have enough left over to buy the macro flash rig.
matt ignoffo
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Re: Twin Flash or Two Flashes?

Post by matt ignoffo »

I will echo Chris. I have done the two flash thing wirelessly with Nikon, which is a relatively easy setup compared to many....but it is still a pain in the arse carting around two flashes and a bracket. Not to mention constantly having to fiddle around with aiming them and turning down the output on one or the other etc. A friend of mine uses the Canon twin macro flash rig and likes it, but as far as I see, the results are always damn good, but seem always the same, not too much lighting imagination going on.

I will say this much. In all honesty, though it is not fancy and won't get the attention of onlookers like a big old setup - some of the best macro photography I have seen (as far as up to 1:1 anyway) has been done by talented photographers diffusing their pop-up flash or a single hot shoe mount.
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sjfriend
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Re: Twin Flash or Two Flashes?

Post by sjfriend »

My set up is half and half, on body flash with an external slave. I use the slave on a bracket wirelessly with the body flash as the master. That way I can change angles and output without the weight and bulk of the second flash. I use it all the time for close and macro. Nice thing is slave runs on manual at around 1/8 - 1/128th power which makes for fast cycle times. You do have to fiddle with f-stop and power. That's where testing and the quick review of digital shines.

Good luck and good shooting

Steve
fvachss
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Re: Twin Flash or Two Flashes?

Post by fvachss »

chrish wrote: I'm curious, why would you buy a Full Frame camera for macro work?
Sure the 5d series give outstanding high ISO performance and low pixel densities, particularly at high ISO. But the pixel densities of lower resolution APS-C camera bodies is almost as good as long as you aren't printing billboard sized prints. And since you are using flash, you aren't going to need ISO 3200 for your shots.
With the smaller sensors you get the the 1.6x crop (magnification) bonus plus you are taking pictures with the sharpest part of your lenses.

You could get an outstanding camera to do the same job for 1/2 or 2/3 the price and have enough left over to buy the macro flash rig.
I can't argue with the economics, but I've shot a lot of macro with both crop and full frame cameras and do prefer the FF in some circumstances:
1. Natural light macro (usually stopped way down, so high ISO performance matters)
2. Using dedicated high magnification lens like the Canon 65mm MP-E, I find the magnification range is more useful on FF.
3. Even using diffused flash as the main light many times I'll blow a highlight on a reflective surface. Dynamic range and highlight recovery are noticeably better on FF than crop (at least for the same generation of sensor).

All that said, if I were shooting a macro lens with a max magnification of 1:1, as chrish said, the extra magnification advantage would push me toward a crop body.


As far as the OP's question is concerned, macro twin flashes really just buy you convenience. I have a Canon MT-24EX and find it pretty easy to use - without all the erector set gymnastics of two standalone flashes on off-shoe mounts. You can do perfectly fine macro with a single conventional flash, though, so long as you mount it well away from the lens to avoid shadowing
bgorum
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Re: Twin Flash or Two Flashes?

Post by bgorum »

Two flashes will definitely give you more flexibility in terms of where you can position them, but the twin flash will likely be much simpler to use. I’ve got the two flash option and in many cases I really appreciate the ability to bring the flashes in from various positions. However, when I’m photographing calling frogs at night the ability to position the flash anywhere I want often takes a backseat to just keeping the light on the dam frog and trying not to water damage my camera. In those cases I forego the two flashes and just mount one flash on a Wimberly bracket for a simpler and easier way of working. If I had a twin flash when I was photographing frogs I could use one of the lights to fill in some of the shadows cast by the other, but still maintain a pretty simple to use rig. I’ve been eyeing the Really Right Stuff flash brackets that are basically a semicircular piece of metal that mount to your lens’s tripod collar and have flash attachments that can be located anywhere along that semicircle. Seems like they would give you much of the same function as a twin flash. Unfortunately they are almost unbelievably expensive. Also, a related issue in regards to using wireless flash- I don’t know about Canon, but Nikon uses pre-flashes before the picture is taken to determine exposure with the flash. This causes there to be a slight delay between when you press the shutter release and when the picture is actually taken. I’ve found that for species with short calls, (in my case it was Baja California treefrogs), that I was missing the moment when the vocal sack was fully inflated and instead would get pictures as the sack was starting to deflate. Attaching the flash to the camera with a cord remedied that problem.
MonarchzMan
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Re: Twin Flash or Two Flashes?

Post by MonarchzMan »

Thanks for the advice, all. I think that I'm actually going to go for the 7D and get the complete set of lenses that I want, a twin flash, and a regular Speedlite. I'll probably get a FFS camera in a year or two when prices have come down and use that one as my primary and the 7D as my backup.
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kit fox
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Re: Twin Flash or Two Flashes?

Post by kit fox »

Here is an idea, that requires a bit of fabrication.

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Macro setup with new lens #2 by Lord V, on Flickr

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Picture of my macro rig by Lord V, on Flickr

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Me, cat and macro rig by Lord V, on Flickr

It may look funny, but, the quality of his images speaks volumes:

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fly closeup by Lord V, on Flickr

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Moth on a leaf by Lord V, on Flickr
matt ignoffo
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Re: Twin Flash or Two Flashes?

Post by matt ignoffo »

A perfect example of what I was talking about in my previous post. Multi flashes are far from necessary (or convenient) for macros up to about 1:1. He could have similar results just plopping his flash on the hot shoe with a little adjusting I am sure.

I use this sometimes with good results. Just using the on camera flash....so simple, and 1:1 is no prob with a 100mm. The thing is three bucks and fits in any pocket.

http://www.amazon.com/DMKFoto-Camera-Fl ... r-mr-title

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