Arizona help

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Nate S.
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Arizona help

Post by Nate S. »

First off let me say that I know Arizonans are secretive about their herp spots, I know the whole deal. I'm going to be in Yavapai county a week from today and am staying for 2 weeks and am going to be getting plenty of herping in. If anyone would be cool enough to come herping with me or point me in the direction where I might find some rattlesnakes I would greatly appreciate it and remember it throughout my herping career. I'm currently studying wildlife biology because I want to be a herpetologist so I'm a lifelong herper for sure. I'm really not looking for anything particularly rare I would really love to find Sidewinders, Speckleds, Mojaves or even WDB's. Thanks!
Nate S.
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Nate S. »

Someone please help me find some rattlesnakes! I'll herp regardless but I don't know really where to herp there other than just cruising isolated roads.
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Norman D
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Norman D »

Nate S. wrote:I don't know really where to herp there other than just cruising isolated roads.
You answered part of your own question. Yavapai county is full of great areas to hike and drive on isolated roads. You may have to go a little south or west for sidewinders.

Get this book. It will help you see what kind of habitat you need to cruise and/or hike for specific rattlesnakes.
http://www.amazon.com/Field-Guide-Amphi ... B000KKMWWE

Do your homework now! Your timing will be good to find all your targets. Good luck!
Nate S.
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Nate S. »

Thanks man I appreciate it! My friend who I'm staying with has that book actually. I'm going to be herping Phoenix area and maybe other areas too, in fact I would drive anywhere in AZ if it's a good rattlesnake spot. Any more tips/suggestions anyone?
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gbin
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Re: Arizona help

Post by gbin »

It's been a long time since I lived in AZ (and my wife would kill me if I took off for there just now) so I can't join you in your fun, but hopefully you'll yet attract the invite of one of the state's residents. Keep in mind that the more newcomers to this website tell about themselves, the more quickly they are trusted. But you're going to find some neat stuff whether you're accompanied or not.

If you're not all that experienced, also keep in mind that rattlesnakes can move surprisingly quickly and unexpectedly when they decide to do so. The first sidewinder I found while road cruising in AZ (wow, that was a lot of years ago now :o ), a cute little thing that I had a hard time thinking of as hazardous, reversed direction on me (briefly coming directly at me) so fast when I squatted down too close in order to give myself a really good look at it that I ended up falling back on my butt and having to hurriedly roll away to obtain a safe distance at which to get up. My companions laughed heartily at my pratfall, of course.

Keep in mind that there's always more than one snake out there, too. On any number of occasions I've seen folks unwittingly put themselves in harm's way getting too close to a snake they didn't see because of their rapt attention to a snake they did see. Probably the worst was when a herping buddy's girlfriend almost stepped with her sandaled foot on a juvenile mojave off the side of the road while getting out of the car to look at a big western diamondback we'd spotted on the pavement; we hadn't even equipped her with a flashlight because she was just along for the ride (making us all dangerously stupid on that occasion).

And for heaven's sake, be sure to buy a license and look over the regulations before you start to herp hunt. You can easily do so online, and a non-resident's short-term license doesn't really cost all that much considering everything else you're paying for your trip. (I also think of my licenses as mementos of my trips.) It doesn't matter if you're only photographing, not collecting, etc. - you're using the resource, so you should abide by the law and help contribute to the resource's management. Too, especially these days, those isolated roads aren't as isolated as you might think.

Oh, and if you plan to do any hiking in the desert, do yourself a favor and carry a comb which you can use when you inevitably run afoul of some cholla. You don't want to grab that stuff with your fingers. I learned that lesson the hard way, myself. ;)

Good luck!

Gerry
Nate S.
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Nate S. »

gbin wrote:It's been a long time since I lived in AZ (and my wife would kill me if I took off for there just now) so I can't join you in your fun, but hopefully you'll yet attract the invite of one of the state's residents. Keep in mind that the more newcomers to this website tell about themselves, the more quickly they are trusted. But you're going to find some neat stuff whether you're accompanied or not.

If you're not all that experienced, also keep in mind that rattlesnakes can move surprisingly quickly and unexpectedly when they decide to do so. The first sidewinder I found while road cruising in AZ (wow, that was a lot of years ago now :o ), a cute little thing that I had a hard time thinking of as hazardous, reversed direction on me (briefly coming directly at me) so fast when I squatted down too close in order to give myself a really good look at it that I ended up falling back on my butt and having to hurriedly roll away to obtain a safe distance at which to get up. My companions laughed heartily at my pratfall, of course.

Keep in mind that there's always more than one snake out there, too. On any number of occasions I've seen folks unwittingly put themselves in harm's way getting too close to a snake they didn't see because of their rapt attention to a snake they did see. Probably the worst was when a herping buddy's girlfriend almost stepped with her sandaled foot on a juvenile mojave off the side of the road while getting out of the car to look at a big western diamondback we'd spotted on the pavement; we hadn't even equipped her with a flashlight because she was just along for the ride (making us all dangerously stupid on that occasion).

And for heaven's sake, be sure to buy a license and look over the regulations before you start to herp hunt. You can easily do so online, and a non-resident's short-term license doesn't really cost all that much considering everything else you're paying for your trip. (I also think of my licenses as mementos of my trips.) It doesn't matter if you're only photographing, not collecting, etc. - you're using the resource, so you should abide by the law and help contribute to the resource's management. Too, especially these days, those isolated roads aren't as isolated as you might think.

Oh, and if you plan to do any hiking in the desert, do yourself a favor and carry a comb which you can use when you inevitably run afoul of some cholla. You don't want to grab that stuff with your fingers. I learned that lesson the hard way, myself. ;)

Good luck!

Gerry

Thanks so much for your reply! I'm not real experienced with rattlesnakes yet although I encountered quite a few this year here in CA, but I have worked with lots of different types of wild animals. I have volunteered at a lot of zoos, worked at a wild animal sanctuary and interned at Out of Africa Wildlife Park in Camp Verde, AZ for 3 months last winter. So I'm headed back there next week to visit friends and also get as much herping in as possible. LOL at your Sidewinder story I've heard they can be a bit fiesty but wow thats crazy!
" On any number of occasions I've seen folks unwittingly put themselves in harm's way getting too close to a snake they didn't see because of their rapt attention to a snake they did see."- I have almost done that before too not almost step on a juvenile Mojave with sandals lol but I saw a juvenile Northern Pacific in this little canyon I was in and totally did not see another one like 2 feet away from my foot. Thanks for the advice about the licenses I will be sure to do that and the comb for the cholla cactus although last year when I was working at the Wildlife Park there it was those damn catclaw bushes that was constantly getting me!
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gbin
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Re: Arizona help

Post by gbin »

Well, I must admit that I was considered something of a cholla magnet by my friends...

I know I'm not by any means the only such, though! For a wildlife example with a happy ending: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/1 ... 93417.html

:o

Gerry
Nate S.
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Nate S. »

Poor little guy! Yeah I will be watching out for cacti, it seems like everything in the desert is out to get you. Anybody else have any advice or want to go Herping while I'm out there? I'd really appreciate it!
Nate S.
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Nate S. »

Help me find rattlesnakes in AZ I figured out where I am staying in Camp Verde has a good number of pyros and milks but where might be a good rattlesnake spot? Or someone just come Herping with me it'll be awesome!! I'm a pretty good herper too I just don't know AZ.
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reptilist
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Re: Arizona help

Post by reptilist »

When I drove through that area last month I was intrigued by Wet Beaver Creek. But I did not get there. If you head towards Montezuma Well, and go past it to the North a few miles, there is a turnoff to Beaver Creek campground, which might be a good jumping off point. Good luck!
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CCarille
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Re: Arizona help

Post by CCarille »

I haven't spent a lot of time in AZ, but the little herping I did there I found both subspecies of Gila monster (one road cruised and the other just off a trail). Best advice I can give, is get out as much as you can. I was there for backpacking and you can't find snakes unless you're out looking for them.
gbin wrote: Oh, and if you plan to do any hiking in the desert, do yourself a favor and carry a comb which you can use when you inevitably run afoul of some cholla. You don't want to grab that stuff with your fingers. I learned that lesson the hard way, myself. ;)
Gerry
I second Gerry's sentiments. While backpacking in Tucson, I somehow got a cholla section stuck to every finger on my left hand. The spines are sheathed and have backwards facing barbs that come out when the sheath pulls back. Subsequently, I had to use a utility tool to cut away the spines and then use pliers to yank out each spine from my fingers.... the whole mess was pretty funny but definitely not delightful.
Nate S.
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Nate S. »

Thanks reptilist I really appreciate man!! I will for sure check that spot out and a couple isolated roads I know of. I also was thinking of herping South Mnts in Phoenix and also at some point during my stay might even go to Tucson.
Nate S.
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Nate S. »

Ok thanks for the advice and heads up on the cacti. Haha It's starting to sound like I should more worried about the cacti then getting tagged by a rattlesnake.
Aaron
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Aaron »

My companions laughed heartily at my pratfall, of course.
I thought pratfall traps were illegal in AZ?
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Fundad
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Fundad »

Help me find rattlesnakes in AZ I figured out where I am staying in Camp Verde has a good number of pyros and milks but where might be a good rattlesnake spot?
There are no milk snakes at Camp Verde (known to science or any of us anyway)..

Rattlesnakes are easy and common in AZ. I am sure if you match the habitat in the field guide, to suitible habitat where you go, you will do great.. There are NO magic spots in AZ, its really a matter of knowing the conditions of when to go and trying to do it at any location..

Fundad
Nate S.
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Nate S. »

Fundad wrote:
Help me find rattlesnakes in AZ I figured out where I am staying in Camp Verde has a good number of pyros and milks but where might be a good rattlesnake spot?
There are no milk snakes at Camp Verde (known to science or any of us anyway)..

Rattlesnakes are easy and common in AZ. I am sure if you match the habitat in the field guide, to suitible habitat where you go, you will do great.. There are NO magic spots in AZ, its really a matter of knowing the conditions of when to go and trying to do it at any location..

Fundad
Thanks for the reply maybe I got it mixed up, I've heard about pyros there for sure. Cool thanks for the advice man I hope finding some different species of rattlesnakes turns out to be that easy but although there are no magic herp spots in AZ, herpers do have their little spots where they regularly find stuff.

Nate
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Fundad
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Fundad »

I go to AZ without any help all the time with much success. Often times others spots aren't as good as places you find on your own. And the advise often hurts more than it helps imo.

Fundad
Nate S.
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Nate S. »

I haven't been herping long so I think I might benefit from some advice. But yeah I'm definitely going to do my own thing herping for the most part but just wanted a couple spots I could check out that people know are productive.
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gbin
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Re: Arizona help

Post by gbin »

Nate S. wrote:... just wanted a couple spots I could check out that people know are productive.
Well, you've asked for such a number of times now, so there's no need to continue doing so. People will either share spots with you or they won't - and you started out this thread acknowledging that they're not likely to - so there's nothing to be gained by all of the repetition. Except a reputation as a troll, that is.

You're not a troll, are you, Nate? I hope not. I love to see new people showing up at FHF, but the new characters that a few old-timers here routinely create just to tweak everyone else, well, that game is pretty tiresome. And I have to tell you, you are starting to sound like a troll, asking again and again for something you knew from the outset you were unlikely to receive...

Gerry
hellihooks
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Re: Arizona help

Post by hellihooks »

He's not a troll IMO... been posting in the Ca Chapter for a while now... just very new to herping, and (possibly) just lacks the confidence that finding stuff on your own, sans any help, brings. IF I recall correctly... he needed a bit of advice about where best to find herps in the Co. he grew up in... :crazyeyes: :lol: :lol: He's been coming along very nicely...and posting good finds... but hey... 1st trip to AZ? I'll probably be asking for a few 'starting spots' myself... if and when I head that way... :roll: :lol: :lol: jim
Nate S.
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Nate S. »

gbin wrote:
Nate S. wrote:... just wanted a couple spots I could check out that people know are productive.
Well, you've asked for such a number of times now, so there's no need to continue doing so. People will either share spots with you or they won't - and you started out this thread acknowledging that they're not likely to - so there's nothing to be gained by all of the repetition. Except a reputation as a troll, that is.

You're not a troll, are you, Nate? I hope not. I love to see new people showing up at FHF, but the new characters that a few old-timers here routinely create just to tweak everyone else, well, that game is pretty tiresome. And I have to tell you, you are starting to sound like a troll, asking again and again for something you knew from the outset you were unlikely to receive...

Gerry

No I'm not a troll, someone really awesome already PM'd me with some extremely useful info so I'm cool now. As someone said I am new at herping and I did even ask for help herping in my county one time, because for 1 I didnt grow up herping in any serious way anyways and judging from the incredible posts on here I thought people might know better than me. Anyways thanks to all who commented and helped me out, It's going to be an awesome trip i'll post my finds sometime when I get back!

Nate
hellihooks
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Re: Arizona help

Post by hellihooks »

Sorry if I embarrassed you Nate... that was not my intent... :roll: was trying to vouch for ya... :thumb: Good luck on your trip (or as I like to say...Kick Ass and take names) :lol: :lol: jim
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Fieldherper
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Lame

Post by Fieldherper »

Wow. Just plain lame to accuse this guy of being a troll. All I see is a eager herper wanting some tips. Nothing is wrong with that. I am SO tired of seeing this type of thing on the various forums. There are plenty of ways to give tips without giving away too much specific info. The area he is asking about is a BIG place and you couldn't try every spot in a year if you lived there.

I remember when I was an eager herper at the age of 3, 10, 16, 20, etc.... and asking a TON of questions to those in the know. I remember those who blew me off, those who told me "No, I won't give you any info because I think you are going to collect something, yada, yada." But I also remember those who helped me along the way. I am grateful to those who saw an eager young herper and sought to help with my development as a naturalist.

I hate to see young herpers receive a cold reception from the herping "community."

Rock on Nate and post what you find. Yavapai county is an awesome place to herp and enjoy nature. Don't let the bastards get you down.
:beer:
FH
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gbin
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Re: Arizona help

Post by gbin »

Fieldherper wrote:Wow. Just plain lame to accuse this guy of being a troll. All I see is a eager herper wanting some tips. Nothing is wrong with that. I am SO tired of seeing this type of thing on the various forums...
Wow. Just plain lame to accuse a guy of accusing this guy of being a troll. All I see is an experienced FHF participant wondering whether a new fellow might be a troll (more specifically, might be another longtime FHF participant using a new identity to play games, as has unfortunately happened here many times in the past) because said new fellow 1) has extremely few posts, 2) asks for information as a novice herper would, but using language that at times suggests greater knowledge/experience, and 3) starts a thread and then in it asks again and again for people to share their herping spots in AZ, both of which have always been especially hot-button issues here. And the experienced FHF participant brought up the question of/warning about trolling only after providing a relatively lengthy post of advice for the apparent newcomer (which was followed by still more requests for spots). I am SO tired of seeing people misrepresent others in order to put them down on the various forums.
Fieldherper wrote:... Don't let the bastards get you down.
Indeed. :?

If you're for real, Nate, then I hope you have a great trip and I apologize for raising any doubt about you; you'll understand where that doubt comes from after you've been here a while (if you don't already know). And you might also find FH's post instructive in that it demonstrates that people here will often post misrerpresentations of others, be it as part of their reaction to misreading what someone has written, to bolster their side of a weak argument, to pick fights, to personally attack someone they don't like for whatever reason, etc. When it comes to interacting with folks here, then, it's always best to look at what a person actually said and did, and not to be persuaded by others' retelling of it.

Gerry
Nate S.
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Nate S. »

hellihooks wrote:Sorry if I embarrassed you Nate... that was not my intent... :roll: was trying to vouch for ya... :thumb: Good luck on your trip (or as I like to say...Kick Ass and take names) :lol: :lol: jim
Thanks man no hard feelings I was just trying to explain myself, lol I sure will do my best to kick some ass and take names!!
Nate S.
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Re: Arizona help

Post by Nate S. »

It's cool no hard feelings Gerry or anyone else. I feel like I have plenty of info now, I appreciate all the comments and advice thanks to all especially Fieldherper!
hellihooks
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Re: Arizona help

Post by hellihooks »

Nate,
give this a read when you get a chance... :thumb:
http://www.fieldherpforum.com/forum/vie ... h%E2%80%99
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azatrox
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Re: Arizona help

Post by azatrox »

This kind of thing again? Why is it that these same themes come up EVERY year? Tiresome.

Nate, good luck. Do your research and you’ll do fine.

It isn’t hard to figure out why the Arizona Chapter is a relative graveyard compared to other regional chapters. Judging by how willing/unwilling Arizona herpers are to provide a little help to the inexperienced/out of stater, you’d think the ONLY people that don’t poach animals or trash spots are Arizona residents. LOL

-Kris
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gbin
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Re: Arizona help

Post by gbin »

Exactly what kind of thing are you talking about, Kris? I think you've misread this thread.

No one jumped on Nate for asking for help - not even for asking specifically for spots - in AZ. I'm actually both surprised and pleased by that, too, as I don't believe in the need for secrecy that a number of people here regularly advocate.

Contrary to FH's post, no one accused Nate of being a troll, either. I warned him that repeatedly hitting a hot button (asking for herping spots in AZ) could make him look like one, and voiced my own uncertainty on the matter, but that's as far as anything went in that regard.

In fact, I think pretty much everyone who participated in this thread (myself included) took the opportunity to welcome Nate, offer him such advice as they felt they had to share under the circumstances and wish him good luck on his trip. And those who overreacted appear to have done so on his behalf rather than against him. Quite a refreshing change of pace, really! :beer:

Gerry
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