Allegheny Mountain Dusky vs. Northern Dusky

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The Jake-Man
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Location: Lebanon Pennsylvania

Allegheny Mountain Dusky vs. Northern Dusky

Post by The Jake-Man »

Hi everybody, I have a question about dusky salamanders. Is there any easy way to tell allegheny mountain dusky salamanders from northern dusky salamanders? I have found dusky salamanders in Lycoming county PA-

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as well as Lebanon county PA-

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But I have trouble distinguishing the two species, even after reading about them on paherps, and looking at pictures in the database. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
qaz
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Joined: December 27th, 2012, 9:09 am

Re: Allegheny Mountain Dusky vs. Northern Dusky

Post by qaz »

Mountain Dusky Salamander:
- round, slightly longer than the rest of the body
- very sinuous mouth shape
- many have an arrow pattern on their back (2nd and 3rd photo)

Northern Dusky Salamander:
- tail is keeled, less than total body length
- less sinuous mouth shape

It could help to look up some pics of each from you area and see what they look like. Hope that helped!
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The Jake-Man
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Re: Allegheny Mountain Dusky vs. Northern Dusky

Post by The Jake-Man »

So do you think it would be safe to say that the Lycoming county individuals are all mountain duskies and the Lebanon county individuals are all Northern duskies?
qaz
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Re: Allegheny Mountain Dusky vs. Northern Dusky

Post by qaz »

I think so.
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The Jake-Man
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Re: Allegheny Mountain Dusky vs. Northern Dusky

Post by The Jake-Man »

Alright. Thanks for your help!
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Matt J
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Re: Allegheny Mountain Dusky vs. Northern Dusky

Post by Matt J »

I agree with the Lycoming individuals being ochropaheus and he Lebanon individuals being fuscus. You're third pic is a perfect example of ochrophaeus.

For what it's worth, I lived and worked around Lycoming Co. in 2011 and 2012 and all I ever found were Allegheny Mtn Duskies. Looking through my records, I actually never found fuscus up there.
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kyle loucks
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Re: Allegheny Mountain Dusky vs. Northern Dusky

Post by kyle loucks »

I only have a few records of fuscus in Lycoming...

http://www.naherp.com/photo.php?v_id=14013
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spinifer
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Re: Allegheny Mountain Dusky vs. Northern Dusky

Post by spinifer »

Weird though, I would have said three of those fuscus tails were round, had I not known the location.
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