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Anybody want to review my Aransas proposal before I submit?

Posted: February 19th, 2014, 8:21 pm
by chrish
Hey all,

About to submit my proposal to Aransas NWR to get a SUP to allow us to do surveys on the NWR.

Got it all filled out, but I threw it together rather quicky so I thought I would put it before the group for any feedback anyone cares to give.

It is available here (it is a pdf file):

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/990 ... mments.pdf

Please don't edit the form yourself. Just tell me what needs to be changed and where you think it should.

FYI - I am applying for the SUP both as a NAFHA member and as a Biology Faculty member to see if it might improve our odds of approval. I would have to serve as PI, but we could put other people on there later as subpermittees which would allow them to contribute without me being present.

TIA,

Chris

Re: Anybody want to review my Aransas proposal before I subm

Posted: February 20th, 2014, 6:51 am
by Gluesenkamp
Chris, I have some comments. Feel free to call me at 512-389-8722.

Re: Anybody want to review my Aransas proposal before I subm

Posted: February 20th, 2014, 7:00 am
by Soopaman
Sweet. It looks good to me, Chris.

Re: Anybody want to review my Aransas proposal before I subm

Posted: February 20th, 2014, 9:59 am
by Tom Lott
That sounds great, Chris. I've always thought that nocturnal access to that place would produce some interesting finds. The only problems I could foresee would involve: 1) mosquitoes (for the uninitiated), and 2) the continuing drought (which has dried up most of the freshwater ponds on the site, but of course that's useful information also).

How do I determine whether I am an "official" member of this chapter or not (I have entered quite a few records in the database. mostly from my home county)?

Re: Anybody want to review my Aransas proposal before I subm

Posted: February 20th, 2014, 10:09 am
by MAbernathy
Hey Chris,

It looks good to me. I'd be interested in seeing/hearing about the edits from Andy.

Assuming this is approved, I would love to participate. I also might look at getting a similar SUP for Anahuac and/or Brazoria NWR here on the upper coast.

Matt

Re: Anybody want to review my Aransas proposal before I subm

Posted: February 20th, 2014, 11:01 am
by gretzkyrh4
Chris,

Great job putting this together. Can't wait to see how things turn out.
Tom Lott wrote: How do I determine whether I am an "official" member of this chapter or not (I have entered quite a few records in the database. mostly from my home county)?
Tom,

I don't see your name listed on the official members list. I believe the chapter president is the only one that can add members. Try sending jeffro a PM and he should be able to help you out.

Chris

Re: Anybody want to review my Aransas proposal before I subm

Posted: February 20th, 2014, 9:51 pm
by Shane_TX
I would caution against the strict naherp reference. It's one option; there are other avenues of digital data dispersal in TX, for sure. Data gathering will be important to them and that's why we're here, but you're limiting the membership by dictating one database. There are also other somewhat similar organizations that can help (e.g. THS, SWCHR). Nothing wrong with combining forces for access to a particularly interesting (herp-wise) NWR.

Also, don't get overzealous on what data will be entered/provided. It's perfectly reasonable to shoot for full species documentation and ask that participants enter everything new to them, but perhaps it will get a bit burdensome to stop and voucher every herp given that the initial scope is broad. You're exceptionally good at data entry so please don't set the bar so high for the rest of us ;)

Thanks for working on this and you've got our attention! I don't mean to be a bad thorn so please let me know if I can help and I will.

Shane

Re: Anybody want to review my Aransas proposal before I subm

Posted: February 21st, 2014, 4:47 am
by chris_mcmartin
Shane_TX wrote:I don't mean to be a bad thorn
What, is this a new angle for you? :lol: :beer:

Re: Anybody want to review my Aransas proposal before I subm

Posted: February 22nd, 2014, 9:31 am
by chrish
Thanks for all the comments.

If you don't like mosquitoes (lethal concentrations thereof), you won't like herping this refuge. A summer evening after a light rain can be amazing! :shock:
But if herping was easy, everyone would do it. It isn't all flipping boards on a grassy hillside at 65°. :lol:
Shane_TX wrote:I would caution against the strict naherp reference. It's one option; there are other avenues of digital data dispersal in TX, for sure. Data gathering will be important to them and that's why we're here, but you're limiting the membership by dictating one database. There are also other somewhat similar organizations that can help (e.g. THS, SWCHR). Nothing wrong with combining forces for access to a particularly interesting (herp-wise) NWR.
Yes, that's true but you don't have to be a HERP contributor to participate, you just have to let your sighting data be entered into the HERP database. Having the data from this project in several databases defeats the purpose of the project. All the data from the project should be stored together.

As for the other organizations, I am a member of some of those and support them. But what I don't want to see happen here is some sort of perception that says "Aransas NWR is now open to herping, just make sure you report your data". That would kill this project in less than a year, IMHO, and very likely negavitely influence the ability of these projects to expand to other USFWS properties in TX and beyond.

Our surveys have to be conducted within the terms and conditions we agree to with the NWR. Our surveys need to be both discrete and discreet.
Also, don't get overzealous on what data will be entered/provided. It's perfectly reasonable to shoot for full species documentation and ask that participants enter everything new to them, but perhaps it will get a bit burdensome to stop and voucher every herp given that the initial scope is broad. You're exceptionally good at data entry so please don't set the bar so high for the rest of us ;)
The purpose of my proposal is to gather data, not just to go herping. If someone doesn't want to gather data, they don't want to be part of the project. I'm cool with that. I'm also cool with the idea that some survey members won't enter their data, we just ask that they record correctly so that those of us willing to enter it can enter it.

I am deliberately making a commitment to the USFWS/NWR to provide them with service in return for access. That means if we see 300 Southern Leopard Frog records from one day's survey (easily possible), there will be 300 leopard frog records, or at least records of 300 individuals to suitably close geographic coordinates.

Thanks for all the other comments, both privately and here. I have fixed what was suggested and have included a copy of the TX scientific collecting permit I'm on.

I'll send it off this week. Let's see what happens.

Chris

Re: Anybody want to review my Aransas proposal before I subm

Posted: February 22nd, 2014, 7:11 pm
by Shane_TX
chris_mcmartin wrote:
Shane_TX wrote:I don't mean to be a bad thorn
What, is this a new angle for you? :lol: :beer:
Hey, I can't help it if I'm a bit Cassandra-like :lol:

Re: Anybody want to review my Aransas proposal before I subm

Posted: February 22nd, 2014, 7:16 pm
by chris_mcmartin
Shane_TX wrote:
chris_mcmartin wrote:
Shane_TX wrote:I don't mean to be a bad thorn
What, is this a new angle for you? :lol: :beer:
Hey, I can't help it if I'm a bit Cassandra-like :lol:
You lost me on that one...I must be either too young or too old. :P

Re: Anybody want to review my Aransas proposal before I subm

Posted: February 22nd, 2014, 7:21 pm
by Soopaman
chris_mcmartin wrote:
Shane_TX wrote:
What, is this a new angle for you? :lol: :beer:
Hey, I can't help it if I'm a bit Cassandra-like :lol:
You lost me on that one...I must be either too young or too old. :P[/quote]


Dr. Who reference, I believe.

Re: Anybody want to review my Aransas proposal before I subm

Posted: February 22nd, 2014, 7:34 pm
by Shane_TX
It's greek to yous. Anyway, hopefully some Aransas work in the future.

Shane

Re: Anybody want to review my Aransas proposal before I subm

Posted: February 23rd, 2014, 8:34 am
by chrish
Shane_TX wrote:It's greek to yous. Anyway, hopefully some Aransas work in the future.

Shane
Shane,

There is no R in geek. :lol:

Re: Anybody want to review my Aransas proposal before I subm

Posted: February 24th, 2014, 9:32 pm
by Shane_TX
chrish wrote:
Shane_TX wrote:It's greek to yous. Anyway, hopefully some Aransas work in the future.

Shane
Shane,

There is no R in geek. :lol:
You are correct :lol: