Hello fellow herpers of the south east chapter. Although I know mid-western herptiles like the back of my hand I am definitely in new territory here in North Carolina as I just moved here from Colorado yesterday. Anyway I found a frog today (first herp for me here in NC) and after consulting my trusty field guide am still unable to get an I.D. on the little guy. Attached below are some quick photos I snapped before releasing him. If any a y'all SE herpers feel like helping out a noob to the area it would be greatly appreciated! Thanks for reading my post!
Need a frog I.D.
Moderator: Scott Waters
Re: Need a frog I.D.
Well...being down here in Florida I'm not sure how much help I can offer. My first guess would be a fairly young squirrel tree frog; or at the least a Hyla spp. But it also may be a chorus frog of some variety. The toe pads, size of the frog, etc eliminate Ranids, right?
Re: Need a frog I.D.
Looks like a Chorus frog, I think a Spring Peeper.
Re: Need a frog I.D.
Thanks for the reply. I would agree that we could definitely eliminate all ranids. Because of its size and toe pad size I was initially thinking chorus frog. However, because of its climbing behavior and the location in which I found it I starting thinking tree frog (chorus frogs spend most of their time in the water unless I'm mistaken?) and yeah I'm leaning toward either squirrel or upland chorus as of now.Noah M wrote:Well...being down here in Florida I'm not sure how much help I can offer. My first guess would be a fairly young squirrel tree frog; or at the least a Hyla spp. But it also may be a chorus frog of some variety. The toe pads, size of the frog, etc eliminate Ranids, right?
Yes I considered this mainly because of its size but its markings just aren't similar enough to other crucifers I've found.ackee wrote:Looks like a Chorus frog, I think a Spring Peeper.
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- mtratcliffe
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Re: Need a frog I.D.
What county in NC? That could help eliminate a few species.
Re: Need a frog I.D.
I'm pretty sure it isn't a peeper, but I'm not sure what other chorus frogs are up there and around this time of year.
Second matt's questions too - what county was it from.
Second matt's questions too - what county was it from.
Re: Need a frog I.D.
I would generally concur with Noah's first post here. The coloration and pattern looks like some sort of chorus frog, but if you look at the end of the toes, it definitely has treefrog suction pads, which chorus frogs don't have. That leaves peepers and the myriad of treefrogs we have down in the South, and I'd lean toward treefrogs because I've never seen a spring peeper with that coloration and pattern. Usually peepers are lighter and have an "X" pattern on the back (in Virginia, Tennessee, and Michigan anyway). As for what kind of treefrog, I'd just try to match colors if I were you. I come from Michigan originally, where we only have one treefrog!
Jefferson
Jefferson
Re: Need a frog I.D.
I've seen quite a few peepers with no back pattern, or a pattern only faintly present. These little pinkletinks are extremely variable.
- Aneides Aeneus
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Re: Need a frog I.D.
I would call this a squirrel treefrog. I've never seen a peeper with the more or less random dark blotches on the back which you can see in the first photo, and I've seen many squirrel treefrogs like this in North Carolina and Florida.
-Ananth
-Ananth
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Re: Need a frog I.D.
If it isn't a squirrel tree frog, I would say either a southern or upland chorus frog. Peepers can be variable, but they frequently have an X pattern on their back, even if it is rather light. These other Pseudacris species frequntly have dark markings on their back and can be variable. Does anybody else see a dark line by/through the eye? That seems more like a chorus frog than a tree frog to me.
Re: Need a frog I.D.
To summarize all this input, "metamorph hylids are heinous to ID". Ha ha ha.
Seriously though, dorsal pigmentation can steer you awry. Structural things like those expanded toe tips are much more fixed, less flaky.
Something I've done a few times when I got a whole lot of little buggers that all seemed the same or nearly so, but drove me nuts cause I couldn't tell what they were: grow some out. Really, no joke. They grow like weeds, and are easy enough to keep & feed (survival isn't bad at all). When they're a few weeks bigger they start looking a lot more like "who they actually are". Which can either help a ton, or "just some" (not all adult hylids are easily ID'd solely by visual characters).
Anyway, with that grow-out notion, you could even take a time-series of photos of individuals, and make yourself a reference kit. You could even share that. Could be a fun little project, you seem handy enough with a camera. (I'm a little surprised this hasn't been done for some of the major field guides.)
Just a couple of thoughts. Not everybody's cup of tea, but if you really really wanna know, there ya go.
cheers
Seriously though, dorsal pigmentation can steer you awry. Structural things like those expanded toe tips are much more fixed, less flaky.
Something I've done a few times when I got a whole lot of little buggers that all seemed the same or nearly so, but drove me nuts cause I couldn't tell what they were: grow some out. Really, no joke. They grow like weeds, and are easy enough to keep & feed (survival isn't bad at all). When they're a few weeks bigger they start looking a lot more like "who they actually are". Which can either help a ton, or "just some" (not all adult hylids are easily ID'd solely by visual characters).
exactly...the rest being chorus frogs it seemssquirrel treefrog...is what probably 75% of these "what is this frog" posts turn out to be
Anyway, with that grow-out notion, you could even take a time-series of photos of individuals, and make yourself a reference kit. You could even share that. Could be a fun little project, you seem handy enough with a camera. (I'm a little surprised this hasn't been done for some of the major field guides.)
Just a couple of thoughts. Not everybody's cup of tea, but if you really really wanna know, there ya go.
cheers