banded beauty

Dedicated exclusively to field herping.

Moderator: Scott Waters

Post Reply
Brad Alexander
Posts: 71
Joined: June 8th, 2010, 10:56 am
Contact:

banded beauty

Post by Brad Alexander » June 6th, 2011, 8:40 pm

I don't get out much these days nor do I visit the forums much these days either. However, I have been out a select few times, some outings fruitful, some not so much (as is typical for all of us).

Seen a few of these red black and white things the other day. Being lazy, I only photographed the one, besides, it was the nicest of the group. Poor Mike thought he had actually found one. In reality, I looked under the rock, noticed all the red and carefully replaced the rock allowing him the opportunity to think he found one only to snatch his moment away from him seconds later with the truth of the discovery. In the end, the joke was on me when I stepped right over a zonata on the crawl and didn't even see it. Of course Mike seen it and was happy to rub it in. The one on the crawl was in 60% canopy crawling along side a downed log.

Thanks for shaking me loose and getting me in the field Mike.

Image

User avatar
Fundad
Posts: 5721
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 6:11 am
Location: Los Angeles County
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by Fundad » June 6th, 2011, 8:53 pm

As Always Sir Alexander.. Beautiful Photo and finds..

I knew you and Sir Waters, would get along good..

Hope you are well

Fundad

User avatar
Ross Padilla
Posts: 2665
Joined: June 8th, 2010, 5:29 pm
Location: I love L.A.
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by Ross Padilla » June 6th, 2011, 10:18 pm

Awesome :thumb:

User avatar
ChrisNM
Posts: 182
Joined: June 8th, 2010, 7:28 pm
Location: Formerly NM, now DFW Metro
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by ChrisNM » June 6th, 2011, 10:30 pm

good to see ya posting BA! Nice critter too.

Zach_Lim
Posts: 1607
Joined: June 10th, 2010, 7:37 pm
Location: San Francisco, CA
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by Zach_Lim » June 6th, 2011, 10:55 pm

Gorgeous individual! Excellent find

User avatar
DMong
Posts: 195
Joined: June 6th, 2011, 9:42 pm
Location: central Florida
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by DMong » June 7th, 2011, 9:24 am

Wow!,.........seeing a few of those on your outing made it VERY worth-while!!


~Doug

User avatar
Scott Waters
Site Admin
Posts: 678
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 3:08 am
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by Scott Waters » June 7th, 2011, 10:59 am

Brad! Nice to see you, amigo. I was just thinking about you the other day, wondering how ya been. Hope all is well! Good to see you. Nice z. :)

scott

erik loza
Posts: 244
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 8:01 am

Re: banded beauty

Post by erik loza » June 7th, 2011, 12:23 pm

Great looking z. Whereabouts was this, out of curiosity?

User avatar
Carl Brune
Posts: 487
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 10:22 am
Location: Athens, OH
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by Carl Brune » June 7th, 2011, 6:27 pm

Nice... Glad your getting out, at least a little bit.

User avatar
Mike Waters
Posts: 835
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 11:37 am
Location: Bakersfield CA

Re: banded beauty

Post by Mike Waters » June 7th, 2011, 7:14 pm

Brad, I dont think you flipped that rock first. You just dont want to admit that you missed it. :lol:
Image

Brad Alexander
Posts: 71
Joined: June 8th, 2010, 10:56 am
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by Brad Alexander » June 7th, 2011, 9:04 pm

Mike!!! I guess that's what I get for showing you how to find zonata and showing you how to use photoshop.

Erik Loza - "where abouts was this"? In the mountains. Sorry, but giving out locality information is strictly prohibited on this forum.

Everyone else, Thanks! :)

Brad Alexander
Posts: 71
Joined: June 8th, 2010, 10:56 am
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by Brad Alexander » June 7th, 2011, 9:35 pm

Mike, when I said I was jealous of your shirt, I was only joking. You didn't have to go photo shopping my shirt to make me feel better. Since you are sharing.....

Image

And for a closer look

Image

Disclaimer, Mike is a nice guy and whatever way he swings is none of my business, I have absolutely no issue with his preferences and believe in the freedom of choice.

Snake Junky
Posts: 40
Joined: May 2nd, 2011, 10:46 pm
Location: Southern Oregon

Re: banded beauty

Post by Snake Junky » June 7th, 2011, 9:49 pm

Sweet find! Its always a nice treat to find these guys. I found one here in southern Oregon back in April. Reminds me I need to take a return trip to my new rock pile, and get some photos and maybe some video. I am sure there is nice population on this mountain, I only found one Z but over a dozen oreganus. After getting home and looking on google earth I realized i missed the main rock outcrop and slide, as well as three quarters of the prime habitat. :roll: Is this a Sierra zonata? It is much cleaner looking than the ugly z's we have in southern Oregon. Thanks for sharing.

erik loza
Posts: 244
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 8:01 am

Re: banded beauty

Post by erik loza » June 8th, 2011, 3:43 am

Brad Alexander wrote: Erik Loza - "where abouts was this"? In the mountains. Sorry, but giving out locality information is strictly prohibited on this forum...
Brad, thanks for the reply. Not trying to sound unappreciative but that is kind of an insulting response. I wasn't looking for a specific answer, just a what part of the Sierras, out of curiosity. Tuolumne Co.? Just a guess, based on how it looks.

I think we get to a point where it is almost pandering to post pics, but then refuse to give any data about it. The whole "not giving out locality info" is clearly a double-standard here on the forum: How many threads say, for example, what road an alterna was caught on or animal photos from such-and-such national forest? What about that new locale of rosy boa that the fellow posted up about, from the Newberrys in NV? There is obviously value in mentioning some details about and this can absolutely be done without compromising your favorite rockpile or whatever. It is just insulting to get an answer akin to "none of your business".

I caught my first zonata almost 20 years ago, by the way. It was just a question of curiosity, that's all.

User avatar
Fundad
Posts: 5721
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 6:11 am
Location: Los Angeles County
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by Fundad » June 8th, 2011, 5:01 am

Brad, thanks for the reply. Not trying to sound unappreciative but that is kind of an insulting response. I wasn't looking for a specific answer, just a what part of the Sierras, out of curiosity. Tuolumne Co.? Just a guess, based on how it looks.

I think we get to a point where it is almost pandering to post pics, but then refuse to give any data about it. The whole "not giving out locality info" is clearly a double-standard here on the forum: How many threads say, for example, what road an alterna was caught on or animal photos from such-and-such national forest? What about that new locale of rosy boa that the fellow posted up about, from the Newberrys in NV? There is obviously value in mentioning some details about and this can absolutely be done without compromising your favorite rockpile or whatever. It is just insulting to get an answer akin to "none of your business".

I caught my first zonata almost 20 years ago, by the way. It was just a question of curiosity, that's all.
I don't think its insulting to say, I am not going to share with you that info... NOT at all.. Heck I think its insulting to ask on a public forum. No one here owes anybody anything...

You mentioned finding a Z 20 years ago, so you seem to take his response personally, but remember if he answers you here on the forum he tells the whole world..

BTW when PL posted his NV find, I called him, and recommend he remove the exact info, and he did... Mainly because it was a violation and its smart... Not everyone that reads these forums have good intentions.. There are some that carry bags and buckets, and notes from the forum.. just sayin..

Every needs to stop taking it personally when sharing info is rejected publicly..

Just Sayin
Fundad

Brad Alexander
Posts: 71
Joined: June 8th, 2010, 10:56 am
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by Brad Alexander » June 8th, 2011, 5:50 am

Erik Loza -

I'm sorry you feel insulted, that was not my intensions. I was a wee bit of a smarta$$ with my response, but it is based on the question and as Fundad said, it's a bit insulting to even ask. By your explination, I can see where you may feel it is a simple and benign request. But unfortunately, it's not. Asking where you get into the field for something and actually flip for it is much different than asking where you road cruise for something, at least in my book and I'm sure others would agree. Where we go on foot and search the rocks is much more sensitive. Sometimes even county information is too much. Probably not so much in this case though, so I'll tell you, it was found in northern Tulare county.

Also, not to be a jerk or anything, but I can't imagine that you haven't learned by now that around here you need to have some thick skin. So throwing out a response like I did should only communicate the fact that you are asking for something that is inappropriate to ask for. From that, it's wise to simply move on and not complain about it.

erik loza
Posts: 244
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 8:01 am

Re: banded beauty

Post by erik loza » June 8th, 2011, 6:39 am

Thank you, Brad and Fundad, for the replies. It was/is a benign request and I have never caught a z in Tulare Co, so it's a treat to see one from there.

I personally have no issues in telling someone what mountain range/county/general area this or that animal was found in, because in my experience, people who would trash a place (assuming that is the concern...) won't get enough valuable data from that info to warrant some sort of "Hey, let's pack our bags right now", kind of a thing whereas folks who have a more keen interest would find it useful. I'll happily tell someone, "Yeah, go to the San Bernardino Mountains if you want to see parv". Lazy collectors are only going to trash what other lazy collectors already trashed. At least in my experience. That's where I as coming from, is all I am saying.

Regards

User avatar
Mike Waters
Posts: 835
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 11:37 am
Location: Bakersfield CA

Re: banded beauty

Post by Mike Waters » June 8th, 2011, 7:10 am

I personally consider even county info to be too much. Someone might get the idea from this post that now is a good time to find a z and head to the mountains and completely miss the area where this animal was found but completely destroy fundads favorite sierran rockpile. Lazy collectors are being replaced by diligent young herpers who will go to great lengths to find such species as zonata. In most cases there is nothing wrong with that however not everyone shares the same respect for habitat. These questions are best left in someones private message box where I would be more comfortable sharing with a single reputable member rather then the whole world.

Brad,clever idea with the t-shirts photo shop! Wherever did you get that idea.

erik loza
Posts: 244
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 8:01 am

Re: banded beauty

Post by erik loza » June 8th, 2011, 7:22 am

Mike Waters wrote:I personally consider even county info to be too much. Someone might get the idea from this post that now is a good time to find a z and head to the mountains and completely miss the area where this animal was found but completely destroy fundads favorite sierran rockpile. Lazy collectors are being replaced by diligent young herpers who will go to great lengths to find such species as zonata. In most cases there is nothing wrong with that however not everyone shares the same respect for habitat. These questions are best left in someones private message box where I would be more comfortable sharing with a single reputable member rather then the whole world.
No disagreement with any of that but let me float the Devil-Advocate's position out there. You don't need FHF if you want to find this or that snake species. Just Google-image search, for example, "California Mountain Kingsnake" and you will see about 5X more images that appear in the random Flickr and Photobucket accounts from hikers, mountain bikers, and rock climbers than you will from a forum like this. In fact, most of these give specific trails, GPS coordinates, or even exact rock outcrops. I know because I bookmark them for future reference.

So, while I don't disagree with that sentiment, it is rather naive to assume that FHF is the only place someone could get this info and the info here is much less granular than what is available from these other resources.

Brad Alexander
Posts: 71
Joined: June 8th, 2010, 10:56 am
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by Brad Alexander » June 8th, 2011, 7:36 am

Mike - that's a dumb question, you posted it first, obviously it was from you. However, mine is better. :)

Brad Alexander
Posts: 71
Joined: June 8th, 2010, 10:56 am
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by Brad Alexander » June 8th, 2011, 7:38 am

erik loza wrote:So, while I don't disagree with that sentiment, it is rather naive to assume that FHF is the only place someone could get this info and the info here is much less granular than what is available from these other resources.
Speaking of naive, ahhhh nevermind, this is a waste of time.

User avatar
Fundad
Posts: 5721
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 6:11 am
Location: Los Angeles County
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by Fundad » June 8th, 2011, 8:00 am

I personally understand what your saying Erik, but IMO a PM would have been better.. I do understand information is available from other sources, but those sources often don't provide the posters area, he likes to travel to herp. Also
just because there are other sources, it doesn't mean that the poster should feel obligated to add to the pile of information, some of which maybe too much.

IMO, not everyone takes the time to "research", and those that don't research can often be the ones with the least amount of respect for the area and herps...

You have been around here a long time, and I know you feel the way you do, and you share information freely, which you makes you a much better person and friend than I am. That said, I spend an untold number of hours scouting (at home, and IN the field), and why should I or anyone else have an obligation to share that hard work with others publicly?

I guess I am different, I would rather spend 20 hours scouting and herping to find 1 Z, than to go to your spot and see 20.
So its hard for me to understand personally, what others get out of getting exact directions from someone..

Brad escorted my father and I on a trip many years ago, and we saw 18 z's in just a couple hours.. It was a great trip, and I am in debted to Brad for that trip.. It was a great time, that said, the whole time I felt like I cheated myself. (Anytime I go to anyone elses spot or area, I only get so much joy out of it, as it is a HAND out, not a successful HUNT IMO IE CHEATING)

Fundad

erik loza
Posts: 244
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 8:01 am

Re: banded beauty

Post by erik loza » June 8th, 2011, 8:30 am

I think we are more or less on the same page, Fundad. I don't really give out exact spots, either. Just that I feel there are levels of information that can be posted that will fill in the blanks, so to speak, for someone who knows what they are asking, as opposed to "Go to this highway intersection". I remember Staub and Merker taking me on my first official zonata trip, around 1994. The area we went is no huge secret but out of respect, I have never mentioned it to anyone else. I could tell someone "El Dorado Co." and it would still be like trying to hit a dartboard, blindfolded, unless they had more specific info that just that.

You mentioned being in debt to another herper. One person I will always be in debt to is a gentleman named Skip Kruse. You might know him, though I am sure many here will not, but Skip is on the real OG's of California/Baja herping. I first met Skip when I was young, 19 or so. Like all kids, you ask a million questions and like new herpers, you want those "guaranteed board lines" because you are young and impatient. The one thing I will always remember about Skip is that he was happy to discuss habitats and species but never really mentioned specific locales. "The habitat looks like this and this is when I have seen them", or something like, "They're common in such-and such mountain range", then encourage me to go give it a shot. In other words, friendly and willing to share info but not willing to give handouts. He influenced me greatly. Possibly, because I like comparing notes with other herpers, I just run with that conversational attitude and am direct with questions. And possibly, other herpers are more guarded than me. No good nor bad, just different.

Brian Eagar
Posts: 430
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 11:59 am

Re: banded beauty

Post by Brian Eagar » June 8th, 2011, 11:54 am

Beautiful snake! Thanks for sharing it.

User avatar
Mr. Woolery
Posts: 30
Joined: December 6th, 2010, 11:18 pm

Re: banded beauty

Post by Mr. Woolery » June 9th, 2011, 12:38 am

Thanks Erik for making this Brad's only post for the year. :thumb:

hellihooks
Posts: 8025
Joined: June 8th, 2010, 7:12 am
Location: Hesperia, California.
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by hellihooks » June 9th, 2011, 5:35 am

Fundad wrote: I would rather spend 20 hours scouting and herping to find 1 Z, than to go to your spot and see 20.

It was a great time, that said, the whole time I felt like I cheated myself. (Anytime I go to anyone elses spot or area, I only get so much joy out of it, as it is a HAND out, not a successful HUNT IMO IE CHEATING)

Fundad
My feelings exactly!

Brad,
Mike shoulda brought you when we tried for our grandslam... we got skunked for Z's... :roll: Oh well... we got a stand-up dlb and had a good time. That tee-shirt explains his recent fascination with salamanders... good to know... :lol: :lol: jim

User avatar
pete
Posts: 745
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 6:11 pm
Location: cape cod ma.

Re: banded beauty

Post by pete » June 11th, 2011, 6:45 pm

I hope it's not his last of the year! He takes "HOLY SHIT!" photos. :thumb:

hellihooks
Posts: 8025
Joined: June 8th, 2010, 7:12 am
Location: Hesperia, California.
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by hellihooks » June 12th, 2011, 6:51 pm

pete wrote:I hope it's not his last of the year! He takes "HOLY SHIT!" photos. :thumb:
Yes, He does! And those rare sallys are as much hard work to find, as about any other herp I know of.... :shock:
I hope everyone knows I'm just razzing a bud... Mike's bout the manliest man I know... :crazyeyes: :beer: jim

User avatar
rpecora
Posts: 579
Joined: June 10th, 2010, 3:41 pm

Re: banded beauty

Post by rpecora » June 13th, 2011, 11:30 am

Brad, happy to see you post up. Nice shot man.

hellihooks
Posts: 8025
Joined: June 8th, 2010, 7:12 am
Location: Hesperia, California.
Contact:

Re: banded beauty

Post by hellihooks » June 13th, 2011, 5:18 pm

pete wrote:I hope it's not his last of the year! He takes "HOLY SHIT!" photos. :thumb:
DUHHH! thought you were talking bout Mike... :roll: They both take AMAZING shots... :thumb: jim

Post Reply