az trip

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caliboi24
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az trip

Post by caliboi24 » July 23rd, 2011, 10:51 pm

hey guys, i'll be headed out to parker next weekend and was hoping someone would take pity on a poor ca guy who just wants to see some snakes. so if anyone has any tips for me let me know. also if anyone wants to tag along its my treat. I'll cover the gas, and food, drink. let me know.

craigb
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Post by craigb » July 24th, 2011, 7:14 am

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ratsnakehaven
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Re: az trip

Post by ratsnakehaven » July 24th, 2011, 9:22 pm

We don't usually give info on the forum on specific localities like the one you mentioned. Please keep these conversations to pm's. Thanks...Terry ;)

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ratsnakehaven
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Re: az trip

Post by ratsnakehaven » July 24th, 2011, 9:40 pm

PS: It's not that the snakes in the area or in La Paz Co. are a big secret or anything; we just don't want info like, "...take rd. B to the end and flip the tin there to find your targets," to be given to the www. Hope you understand.

BTW, this is the type of thing we've argued over since our inception. It's why there's controversy bt. many of our members. It's why the officers and others ask for caution when giving out info.

Cheers....TC

craigb
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Post by craigb » July 24th, 2011, 11:23 pm

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ratsnakehaven
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Re: az trip

Post by ratsnakehaven » July 25th, 2011, 11:04 am

Thanks, Craig. Your info was general...no problem. It's about the members who don't want to see specifics. Look forward to our visit.

Terry :crazyeyes:

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Brian Hubbs
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Re: az trip

Post by Brian Hubbs » July 26th, 2011, 12:43 pm

I would go to LaPaz county and start at point A, and slowly work my way to Point B after the temps cooled down to the mid-80s, then climb the hill at Point C and look at the stuff at Point D until the sun came up...of course, at this time of year you will need to wait till November for those mid-80s temps... :lol:

I hope this wasn't too specific...

caliboi24
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Re: az trip

Post by caliboi24 » July 26th, 2011, 11:13 pm

thanks guys for the replies, some helpful tips. I am grateful. but I have to say that I am shocked by some of the messages and replies I have seen on this topic in regards to helping people from out town. I live in a resort area that many come to vacation, I have always been willing to advise and help out. I think what we do is a sport. It takes training and knowledge and frankly. I think we should all help out fellow herpers from out of town. As many dont have the amount of time and trial and error to work a certain area. We have put in the time to learn our local area's, as they have not. so Let them enjoy our local herps as much as we do. Not everyone that asks for help. Is some idiiot. Sometimes they are just nice guys from out of town.

By the way.. I was very straight forward and welcomed others to join me. come see how I am. I have nothing to hide. and am not a going to be disrespecful. If you are going to reply with certain locations. I do think it should be done in pm's. but sometimes give others from out of town a chance. I met some cool guys that have been passing through, and have had some awsome herping trips with them. Just my personal thoughts.

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jons
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Re: az trip

Post by jons » July 27th, 2011, 5:44 am

am sure this was just some "nice guy from out of town", too...............
http://www.kold.com/story/15153416/alab ... g-reptiles

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Fundad
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Re: az trip

Post by Fundad » July 27th, 2011, 6:13 am

As many dont have the amount of time and trial and error to work a certain area.
Isn't that the fun part of the HUNT?

Fundad

caliboi24
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Re: az trip

Post by caliboi24 » July 27th, 2011, 12:37 pm

jons wrote:am sure this was just some "nice guy from out of town", too...............
http://www.kold.com/story/15153416/alab ... g-reptiles
Well this is the reason behind the debate on this. its a shame that there is people out there that are like that. All i'm saying is that not everyone is.. before you shut the door in someones face, ask them some questions, feel them out. dont just assume that they are like this.

caliboi24
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Re: az trip

Post by caliboi24 » July 27th, 2011, 12:44 pm

Fundad wrote:
As many dont have the amount of time and trial and error to work a certain area.
Isn't that the fun part of the HUNT?

Fundad

Well I think the hunt is the reason we all do this... But somebody passing through town, who only has a day or so in a certain area, wont have the time it sometimes takes to understand the local herps. Well for me at least. some of you guys that have been doing this forever and are like "herping gods" I swear you guys must have a sixth sence or something. and maybe dont need advice. but others of us, could use alittle help from time to time.

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Brian Hubbs
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Re: az trip

Post by Brian Hubbs » July 27th, 2011, 1:04 pm

We are only "herping Gods" because we've paid our dues for 30+ years with no help from the Internet (because it didn't exist when we were learning this stuff). Back in 1978 I took my first trip to the Colorado River in AZ, and road cruised. It was hotter than hell and I saw nothing. The next year I went earlier and saw a lot of stuff...lesson learned the hard way. I'll tell you straight...we don't want to tell you how and where to do it. We want you to pay your dues just like we did...it will mean so much more to you in the long run... :)

Or, you can do it the easy way and buy my books to get the clues...either way you will still need to try different approaches to get it all figured out...

http://www.mountainkingsnake.com

caliboi24
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Re: az trip

Post by caliboi24 » July 27th, 2011, 2:53 pm

trust me guys, i understand both sides of the issue. I guess for me never having one of my herping spots poached or mistreated, I am more willing to help. Mind you, i'm no "herping god" but I have a few area's figured out. "kinda". I just like to debate thats why I have replied to this. Tips or no tips, i'm still going, skunked or not, i'm still having fun. I like people, I trust people. and I like the idea of having herping buddies in different areas. Thats why I always invite others to tag along. " feel like I should start singing "Cum by ya " right now. hope I did'nt ruffle to many feathers on this one. Just some of my personal thoughts. 8-)

Will

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Brian Hubbs
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Re: az trip

Post by Brian Hubbs » July 27th, 2011, 2:55 pm

I think herping will be tough this time of year, so be sure to bring an air mattress and float on the river. Much better in the heat... :)

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azatrox
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Re: az trip

Post by azatrox » July 27th, 2011, 10:27 pm

You know, I get what you're saying and it really is too bad that Az herpers can't give an out of towner some helpful tips when it comes to locales...It really is too bad that the concern over poaching, habitat destruction, etc. is a very REAL concern here....

From your perspective, your request is a reasonable one...From an Az herper's perspective, your request is a set up for disaster. Not that it's anything personal against you...I have no idea who you are and you very well could be (and probably are) just a guy that wants to see and photo some cool animals...but the fact remains that many areas have been ravaged and many animals have been poached because a naive Az herper has given someone they didn't know "the benefit of the doubt".

There's any number of reasons that Az herpers are uber secret about locales...for some, it's about egotism and "I know a spot that you don't know"....for others, it's a genuine concern for the welfare of the areas and animals... yet for others it's "I put in my time and you should too". Regardless the reasons, you'll find that Az herpers are a tight lipped bunch for the most part.

My best advice to you is to do research on the animals you most want to see....habitat types, elevation, biotic associations, etc....then, consult a resource like Google Earth and "virtually scout" areas that look good....then...get out here and hike/drive them. You probably know all this already, but it's as far as most Az herpers are willing to go re: specific locales.

Anyway, good luck finding what it is you seek!

-Kris

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Brian Hubbs
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Re: az trip

Post by Brian Hubbs » July 28th, 2011, 12:47 am

I guess my response did sound a little egotistical, but the reason we ask others to pay their dues is mainly to protect the habitat and animals. A newbie armed with all the right info can be very dangerous...as I have learned from sharing with a few local people years ago...

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ratsnakehaven
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Re: az trip

Post by ratsnakehaven » July 28th, 2011, 9:56 pm

The main thing, imho, is that this is a public forum and we don't want to say things that the general public can use which might abuse the habitat or the animals, so we stay away from specifics on the forums. Has nothing to do with you personally (try pm's). General information doesn't hurt anything. It's stuff you can pretty much look up or google anyway. Lay out a very specific spot and say you found an interesting herp there and a ton of herpers will be hitting that spot in the near future.

The NAFHA Forums are mostly for taking care of NAFHA business. They are also for sharing amongst members and occasionally visitors. We know there are a lot of lurkers, so we're careful about the real info we disclose. When someone comes on and starts asking for help, it's helpful to us to know who they are, something about them, and if they're a member, or not. An unknown poster could literally be anyone.

Good luck in your visit to the area around Parker. I hope you see some herps worth seeing... :beer:

Terry

Wayne_MO
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Re: az trip

Post by Wayne_MO » August 9th, 2011, 12:35 pm

caliboi24 wrote:Not everyone that asks for help. Is some idiiot. Sometimes they are just nice guys from out of town.
Well, of course, 90% of us who ask for information are exactly as you describe, but since commercial collectors, poachers, and ethical herpers all appear the same on the internet it is better for the habitat, the herps, and the hobby for locals to assume the worst in us even though that assumption will only be correct maybe 10% of the time.

Poachers never say "Hi I'm an illegal collector and I want to take everything I find, tell my partners in crime about the best spots you tell me about and make a bundle off of your generosity and trust. Can you help me out?" so it makes sense for locals to be very cautious and guarded with information.

robert
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Re: az trip

Post by robert » August 19th, 2011, 7:35 pm

All:

In addition to being careful with 'out-of-towners' l(ike myself), the forum may be able to take some positive action in relation to the Alabama person accused of collecting endangered reptiles. Would it be possible for us (as a group) to contact the prosecutor and ask him/her to push for the most severe penalty? Also, it may be possible to have the group write a 'victim statement.' People like this need to be prosecuted the fullest extent of the law. If the prosecutor's office knows that there is a large group of people watching the case, he/she may be less willing to compromise.

Sorry if this post comes (too) close to politics--but maybe it is something we all agree on?

Robert

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