Wild caught albinos???
Moderator: Scott Waters
Re: Wild caught albinos???
In case anyone missed it, there was a really cool AZ coral posted by BayouSurreal. Has to be piebald or something weird.
See the post here.
See the post here.
- Don Becker
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
I posted about this not too long ago. Found here in Iowa earlier in the year by a kid I take herping with me. It's not full albino, just hypo.
Re: Wild caught albinos???
Albino's and piebald are the Holy Grail IMHO. And I have never seen one in the wild.. I ve seen lots of Hypo, some Luestic, a hybrid, and some far out patterned animals, but never an Albino.
And the Albinos and Piebalds posted here make me envious... All of them are really beautiful, even the ringnecks IMO..
Fundad
And the Albinos and Piebalds posted here make me envious... All of them are really beautiful, even the ringnecks IMO..
Fundad
- Getula Hunter
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
Pacific Gopher I found in 2002
Mormon I found in 2003
J.P.
Mormon I found in 2003
J.P.
- Russ_Jones
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
Here's an eastern garter from Southern Ontario. My friend found this a couple of years ago. Last time I posted it there was some discussion as to whether this was colour or stain... I say colour.
Russ
Russ
Re: Wild caught albinos???
A hypomelanistic Tiger Sally from Ga:
Re: Wild caught albinos???
I'm surprised this isn't up yet. A friend sent me the pics, this Opheodrys was found this year in Carolina. Sorry they aren't better quality.
- Steve Atkins
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
!jdustin wrote:In case anyone missed it, there was a really cool AZ coral posted by BayouSurreal. Has to be piebald or something weird.
See the post here.
WOW, that would be a hard one to let go!
- Alex Pepper
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
I agree that coral is one of the most spectacular abberancies I've ever seen, but one major thing to consider is their difficulty to get not only feeding but thriving in captivity without force/tubing feeding. I support his very responsible and mature decision to release it despite the obvious temptations not to.
BUT now if that was a gopher snake or something...
BUT now if that was a gopher snake or something...
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
yeah. If it's a species I know would be next to impossible to establish, that's one thing...if it'd been something I thought there was a good chance of acclimating...oh hubba hubba.
Re: Wild caught albinos???
I don't believe keeping an Arizona Coral Snake is all that difficult. The key is to find a healthy population of tantilla to harvest from. Corals are not uncommon, I would have kept it.
- Chris Smith
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
Russ_Jones wrote:Here's an eastern garter from Southern Ontario. My friend found this a couple of years ago. Last time I posted it there was some discussion as to whether this was colour or stain... I say colour.
Russ
This is a bad a$$ looking garter snake.
-Chris
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
Anerythristic axanthic central newt. Terrestrial adult.
- Natalie McNear
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
Now that's a cool sally.
I guess since this thread isn't just about albinos anymore, I might as well post my only contribution... Possible axanthic Rubber Boa:
I guess since this thread isn't just about albinos anymore, I might as well post my only contribution... Possible axanthic Rubber Boa:
- Scott Waters
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
Hmm. Is that boa a coastal or sierra? It looks like a coastal, which from my experience tend to have a lot less "color" in them than the sierra beasts.
scott
scott
- Natalie McNear
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
It's a coastal, but the belly is much paler than on most other individuals from the same locale (which tend to be more gold-orange). The main weird thing about it is the eyes, which are completely black - normally, when boas are born with black eyes they lighten up in a few months. This snake is now over a year old and still has black eyes, which is common in axanthic and anerythristic individuals (this boa still has some red pigment, so it's not anerythristic).
- Fieldnotes
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
Not quite an albino, but still an interesting find.
- Natalie McNear
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
Hypomelanistic Taricha granulosa?
Re: Wild caught albinos???
jdustin wrote:I'd really like to see some pictures of some albino herps (or other freaks) from the wild.
If anyone has any to contribute, let's see em!
This abnormal zonata was found in San Diego County.
- Nature Nate
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
last spring I found my first albino, an my second, and third, fourth, fifth, up to 50 albino western spadefoot tadpoles in the same vernal pool! unfortunately all the tadpoles (over 100,000) all dried up before they could morph in the wild. fortunately I saved most of the albinos and about 100 of the normals. Once they morphed I released them down some rodent holes in the same area at night. I also gave some to an expert in the field so he could morph the albinos. Here's some pics.
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- Carl Brune
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Re: Wild caught albinos??? -- salamanders
A couple of interesting salamanders I've seen:
Anerythristic? Northern Spring Salamander (Gyrinophilus porphyriticus porphyriticus)
Melanistic? Marbled Salamander (Ambystoma opacum)
Anerythristic? Northern Spring Salamander (Gyrinophilus porphyriticus porphyriticus)
Melanistic? Marbled Salamander (Ambystoma opacum)
Re: Wild caught albinos???
I didn't find this but someone did, and it's for sale.
Albino Tiger Rat snake.
http://market."not allowed"/detail.php?cat=60&de=822554
Albino Tiger Rat snake.
http://market."not allowed"/detail.php?cat=60&de=822554
- Ross Padilla
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
That's awesome, man. I remember the story. Thanks for the fallow up.Nature Nate wrote:last spring I found my first albino, an my second, and third, fourth, fifth, up to 50 albino western spadefoot tadpoles in the same vernal pool! unfortunately all the tadpoles (over 100,000) all dried up before they could morph in the wild. fortunately I saved most of the albinos and about 100 of the normals. Once they morphed I released them down some rodent holes in the same area at night. I also gave some to an expert in the field so he could morph the albinos. Here's some pics.
- concinnusman
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
Nir wrote:
Weird eastern garter found here in Quebec in 2006. Some sort of albino....
Looks hypomelanistic. These have been found before. They aren't quite albino, not quite normal. Something in between.
That is quite possibly the weirdest eastern I have ever seen. It definitely has the traits of a melanistic eastern but like it was painted red on top. Very strange. Reminds me of this erythristic northwestern garter snake a friend of mine caught near Portland, Oregon. Dang thing looks like it crawled through red wood stain. It's the smaller male courting a female. I still have both the snakes in the picture.Russ_Jones wrote:Here's an eastern garter from Southern Ontario. My friend found this a couple of years ago. Last time I posted it there was some discussion as to whether this was colour or stain... I say colour.
Russ
- concinnusman
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
Awesome! I spent much of my high school years in San Diego back in the 1980's. I found several albino toadlets there. Also found quite a few albino CA slender salamanders, often several at a time under one piece of plywood or under rocks. Then one day... Jackpot! newly hatched CA king snakes. About 8 of them under a piece of plywood. 3 of them were albino, and one of the albinos was a striped phase!Nature Nate wrote:last spring I found my first albino, an my second, and third, fourth, fifth, up to 50 albino western spadefoot tadpoles in the same vernal pool! unfortunately all the tadpoles (over 100,000) all dried up before they could morph in the wild. fortunately I saved most of the albinos and about 100 of the normals. Once they morphed I released them down some rodent holes in the same area at night. I also gave some to an expert in the field so he could morph the albinos. Here's some pics.
For some reason, I got used to finding albino amphibians, but when I found the albino king snakes, I just about had a heart attack!
Good job saving the toads. I wouldn't have released them though. Chances are, they won't make it out there. The parents that spawned them were probably hets. Good that you saved some albinos for captivity.
Re: Wild caught albinos???
Never found a verified albino, but I did find what I believe to be a melanistic Contia -
I saw a single bullfrog tadpole that looked to be albino, but it possibly was just covered with a white fungus. I thought it was dead until it swam away. Dead tadpoles usually don't swim. Did not see any others that year, nor any this year.
Could have been released, pet stores sometimes sell albino bullfrog tadpoles. If the gene follows simple Mendel then I suspect I should have seen more than 1 if it was bred in that pool.
I have also (early teens) found an anery Coast Range Garter. And no, it didn't look like a Mountain. The lack of red/yellow also impacted the dorsal stripe, which was visible but looked like charcoal had been rubbed over it. Adult male found in vicinity of Half Moon Bay, CA.
I saw a single bullfrog tadpole that looked to be albino, but it possibly was just covered with a white fungus. I thought it was dead until it swam away. Dead tadpoles usually don't swim. Did not see any others that year, nor any this year.
Could have been released, pet stores sometimes sell albino bullfrog tadpoles. If the gene follows simple Mendel then I suspect I should have seen more than 1 if it was bred in that pool.
I have also (early teens) found an anery Coast Range Garter. And no, it didn't look like a Mountain. The lack of red/yellow also impacted the dorsal stripe, which was visible but looked like charcoal had been rubbed over it. Adult male found in vicinity of Half Moon Bay, CA.
Re: Wild caught albinos???
Given that the species spends most of its time underground, albinism may not be as detrimental to the specimens as it is for some other species.concinnusman wrote: Good job saving the toads. I wouldn't have released them though. Chances are, they won't make it out there. The parents that spawned them were probably hets. Good that you saved some albinos for captivity.
-=-
I have no idea how hard it is to captive breed spadefoot toads, but assuming the albinism was caused by genes and not some other cause, would captive bred albino western spadefoot toads be legal to commercially sell in California?
- concinnusman
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
I'm thinking probably not, considering they occur in CA naturally. You do have a point about the albino toads. Could also apply to the albino CA slender salamanders I was finding. There were quite a few and many of them were fully mature.FunkyRes wrote:Given that the species spends most of its time underground, albinism may not be as detrimental to the specimens as it is for some other species.concinnusman wrote: Good job saving the toads. I wouldn't have released them though. Chances are, they won't make it out there. The parents that spawned them were probably hets. Good that you saved some albinos for captivity.
-=-
I have no idea how hard it is to captive breed spadefoot toads, but assuming the albinism was caused by genes and not some other cause, would captive bred albino western spadefoot toads be legal to commercially sell in California?
Re: Wild caught albinos???
I'm not sure, but I seem to remember reading that CA specifically excludes albinos from many of their wildlife laws.
Re: Wild caught albinos???
To sell a native albino in CA it has to be cb. Protected species are excluded from this.
- Natalie McNear
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
And they are pretty strict about the term "albino", using it only in the purest sense - a "white animal with red eyes" is how they phrase it, I believe. That means that simple amelanistic animals (like many of the ones posted on this thread, which a lot of people refer to as "albino") would technically be illegal to sell in California because although they have red eyes, they are not white in color. It also rules out leucistic animals, which are solid white but have dark eyes. Not that it seems to be strictly enforced though - I've seen amelanistic (not albino) rattlesnakes for sale in stores here.
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
I know there's a lot of Alb. Tx. atrox for sale up in your area, but I don't know of too many 'Native' alb crote strains out there, much less in pet shops... Then again, I don't follow the 'exotic' market... or even have any 'out-of-state' hots, as a law-abiding citizen, and as Board Member, there's NO WAY I'm about to risk a black eye for Nafha, by getting caught with ANYTHING questionable. All that 'questionable stuff' is awesome, and tempting... but I'd rather sleep good at night... jimNatalie McNear wrote:And they are pretty strict about the term "albino", using it only in the purest sense - a "white animal with red eyes" is how they phrase it, I believe. That means that simple amelanistic animals (like many of the ones posted on this thread, which a lot of people refer to as "albino") would technically be illegal to sell in California because although they have red eyes, they are not white in color. It also rules out leucistic animals, which are solid white but have dark eyes. Not that it seems to be strictly enforced though - I've seen amelanistic (not albino) rattlesnakes for sale in stores here.
Don't get me wrong... if I EVER find an ALB... I'd try to keep and breed it....unless its like a leafnose, or something else impossible to keep alive.
Re: Wild caught albinos???
I specifically asked about this when I called.Natalie McNear wrote:And they are pretty strict about the term "albino", using it only in the purest sense - a "white animal with red eyes" is how they phrase it, I believe. That means that simple amelanistic animals (like many of the ones posted on this thread, which a lot of people refer to as "albino") would technically be illegal to sell in California because although they have red eyes, they are not white in color. It also rules out leucistic animals, which are solid white but have dark eyes. Not that it seems to be strictly enforced though - I've seen amelanistic (not albino) rattlesnakes for sale in stores here.
My pink eyed albino Cal King was exempt because she had pink eyes even though she had yellow pigment.
My lavender albino Cal King was NOT exempt because she had blue eyes (not really albino IMHO, but a type of hypo).
Re: Wild caught albinos???
Can't believe no one commented on the pink Brahminy blindsnake. How does that work...being that they are parthenogenic this must have been a spontaneous mutation.
So it seems those albino spadefoots are excluded from F&G regs if they are CB from these WC albinos.
So it seems those albino spadefoots are excluded from F&G regs if they are CB from these WC albinos.
Re: Wild caught albinos???
See Jeff's post. Protected species are excluded from the albino exception (which is what I was curious about), so if those legally possessing the WC albino spadefoots did breed them, they couldn't hit the pet trade.Joseph S. wrote:Can't believe no one commented on the pink Brahminy blindsnake. How does that work...being that they are parthenogenic this must have been a spontaneous mutation.
So it seems those albino spadefoots are excluded from F&G regs if they are CB from these WC albinos.
- John Martin
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
Me too! That is probably the most incredible aberrancy I've seen in a snake. As for successfully keeping Micruroides - I found an ~19" adult in 1980 and maintained it in captivity for 22 years after which it finally succumbed to, I suppose, old age. In this time it accepted as food items: Leptotyphlops, Tantilla, Rhinocheilus, Arizona, Hypsiglena, Phyllorhynchus, and Sonora. Many of these were fresh road kills which were frozen and later thawed. Oh, and this thread has been awesome, showing some really cool "freaks".reptilist wrote:I don't believe keeping an Arizona Coral Snake is all that difficult. The key is to find a healthy population of tantilla to harvest from. Corals are not uncommon, I would have kept it.
- Harold of the Rocks
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
Here is a Pacific Gopher a friend of mine found as a hatchling and later gave to me.
So far there are some poss. hets produced.
Ben
So far there are some poss. hets produced.
Ben
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- herpseeker1978
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
beautiful snake! Those eyes are huge!
Josh
Josh
Re: Wild caught albinos???
That Pit morph is awesome!
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
Stop holding it so dang tight Ben... It's eyes are popping out... seriously... whats up with that... congenital defect along with the albinoism? Killer herp man! My cb alb Sonoran is probably my favorite pit. jim
- Kevin McRae
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
I know with leucistic texas ratsnakes "bugged eyed" is a common genetic defect. Mostly likely the same with the pit above.hellihooks wrote:Stop holding it so dang tight Ben... It's eyes are popping out... seriously... whats up with that... congenital defect along with the albinoism? Killer herp man! My cb alb Sonoran is probably my favorite pit. jim
- Jeremiah_Easter
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
That Gopher is absolutely hideous. Poor thing
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
I know you've grown used to it... but have you looked at your avatar lately... I find that statement issueing from your avatar hilariousley paradoxically incongrouous....A PERFECT Dichotomy...TOO FUNNY... jimJeremiah_Easter wrote:That Gopher is absolutely hideous. Poor thing
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
If you showed that leucistic Gopher snake to a breeder, they'd probably say those bug eyes are the result of too much inbreeding. Leucistic Texas Rat snakes seemed to develop the bug eyes from inbreeding. Its kind of strange one would be found like that in the wild. Maybe its not due to inbreeding after all.
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
I have the feeling I might be in for a jolt of reality upon actually meeting Jeremiah
hellihooks wrote:I know you've grown used to it... but have you looked at your avatar lately... I find that statement issueing from your avatar hilariousley paradoxically incongrouous....A PERFECT Dichotomy...TOO FUNNY... jimJeremiah_Easter wrote:That Gopher is absolutely hideous. Poor thing
Re: Wild caught albinos???
Talk about a 'LOOKER'
That thing is FUGLY.
That thing is FUGLY.
Re: Wild caught albinos???
Do any inbred rat snakes possess that trait without being leucistic?Ross Padilla wrote:If you showed that leucistic Gopher snake to a breeder, they'd probably say those bug eyes are the result of too much inbreeding. Leucistic Texas Rat snakes seemed to develop the bug eyes from inbreeding. Its kind of strange one would be found like that in the wild. Maybe its not due to inbreeding after all.
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
The bug eyed condition is characteristic of leucism in snakes and usually occurs in the F2 generation. Wild-caught leucistics never (presumably) show this trait because they represent a single, one time, spontaneous mutation. I'm guessing that that snake was the result of captive breeding or was captured in the wild as an escapee. Either way, captive produced. Does anybody know of any legitimately wild-born leucistic snake of any kind that possessed the bug-eyed trait?
In captivity these snakes are allowed to survive and breed. With the first het-to-het or het-to-leucistic generation to include leucistic babies, a large percentage of these babies often (usually) exhibit the bug-eyed trait. Obviously the more inbreeding that is done, the more prominantly the trait pops up. However, intense inbreeding is not required Interestinly enough, but not completely unexpected, normal-colored hets never exhibit the bug eyed condition.
Cheers,
TV
In captivity these snakes are allowed to survive and breed. With the first het-to-het or het-to-leucistic generation to include leucistic babies, a large percentage of these babies often (usually) exhibit the bug-eyed trait. Obviously the more inbreeding that is done, the more prominantly the trait pops up. However, intense inbreeding is not required Interestinly enough, but not completely unexpected, normal-colored hets never exhibit the bug eyed condition.
Cheers,
TV
- dezertwerx
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
Crazy looking eyes for sure... kinda creepy
- Ross Padilla
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Re: Wild caught albinos???
I guess Terry answered that question. I have no idea.FunkyRes wrote:Do any inbred rat snakes possess that trait without being leucistic?Ross Padilla wrote:If you showed that leucistic Gopher snake to a breeder, they'd probably say those bug eyes are the result of too much inbreeding. Leucistic Texas Rat snakes seemed to develop the bug eyes from inbreeding. Its kind of strange one would be found like that in the wild. Maybe its not due to inbreeding after all.