Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database request

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jonathan
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Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database request

Post by jonathan » December 12th, 2011, 12:32 am

The only questionable record I saw in Ventura County was a California Night Snake.

Ventura County is next to LA County, but only has 651 records in the database. Its habitats are less diverse than LA, but it also has more isolated land to look at. As a result, more data is needed for everything – especially everything that’s not relatively easy to find. This was made clear to us in the recent data request. Though data was requested for several snakes that may be common in Ventura County (ringnecks, night snakes, and coachwhip, along with the less-frequently observed glossys, blind snakes, tantilla, lyre, and san diego mtn. king), we were only able to provide 35 records total. I wish it had been closer to 200.


This is what we do have for Ventura County

Blackbelly Slender Salamander
Monterey Ensatina (only 2 records)
Yellow-blotched Ensatina (only 2 records)
Arboreal Salamander (only 1 record from 2008)
California Newt (only 1 record from 2004)

Baja California Chorus Frog
California Chorus Frog
American Bullfrog (only 2 records)
California Red-legged Frog (only 1 record from 1982)
California Toad
Arroyo Toad (only 1 record from 2008)
Western Spadefoot (only 2 records)

Western Pond Turtle

California Legless Lizard (only 2 records)
San Diego Alligator Lizard
Western Redtail Skink (only 1 record)
Western Skink (only 3 vouchered records)
Coast Horned Lizard
Western Sagebrush Lizard
Coast Range Fence Lizard
Great Basin Fence Lizard
Western Side-blotched Lizard
California Whiptail

Northern Rubber Boa (only 2 records)
Western Black-headed Snake (only 1 record)
San Bernardino Ringneck Snake
Monterey Ringneck Snake (only 4 records)
San Diego Night Snake
California Night Snake (only 1 record – misID?)
California Kingsnake
Coast Mountain Kingsnake (only 2 records, none since 2004)
San Diego Mountain Kingsnake (only 1 vouchered record from 2002)
Sierra Mountain Kingsnake (only 1 record from 2007)
Longnose Snake (only 1 record)
San Diego Gopher Snake
Coast Patchnose Snake (only 1 record)
Western Yellow-bellied Racer (only 2 vouchered records)
Sriped Racer
Red Coachwhip
Two-striped Garter Snake
Southern Pacific Rattlesnake


HERPS THAT ARE NOT YET VOUCHERED FOR VENTURA COUNTY

Foothill Yellow-legged Frog (historic range)
African Clawed Frog (introduced?)

Snapping Turtle (introduced?)
Red-eared Slider (introduced)
Painted Turtle (introduced?)

Banded Gecko?
Zebratail Lizard?
Long-nosed Leopard Lizard?
Great Basin Collared Lizard?
Desert Spiny Lizard
Coastal Whiptail (southern part of county)
Yucca Night Lizard
San Nicolas Night Lizard

Blind Snake
California Glossy Snake
Diablo Range Garter Snake?
California Red-sided Garter Snake
Baja California Lyre Snake

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monklet
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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by monklet » December 12th, 2011, 8:23 am

Thanks Jonathan for your hard work putting that together. Hope I can pick up some more this coming season.

I do know of a Lyre Snake record with photo and I've been trying to get the finder to post ...just hasn't happened yet. :(

I had a cat kill Tantilla on my porch ...crummy way to find it, but that was way back before I was conscious of the DB. Same goes for RES, patchie, nightsnake.

Pretty confident we're not going to have:
Zebra-tailed, Collared, Desert Spiny, or Long-nosed Leopard Lizards. Maybe Yucca Night though??? ...and Banded Gecko???

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Fieldnotes
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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by Fieldnotes » December 12th, 2011, 9:32 am

Brad you might be "jumping-the-gun." :shock: The Long-nosed Leopard is widespread in Frazier, Lockwood Valley, and Cuyama Valley area. Blunt-nosed Leopard hybrids are in Cuyama Valley. Desert Spiny Lizard occur on the maritime drainage of Piru Creek at Hardluck Campground where it associates with coastal herpetofauna. Desert Night Lizards Lockwood Valley and Cuyama Valley. sounds like a nice close place for a field trip. :beer:

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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by RobertH » December 12th, 2011, 10:16 am

sounds like a nice close place for a field trip.
Yes, it does. :shock: I's say, let's put this one inofficially on the NAFHA survey agenda for 2012 right now.

Robert

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monklet
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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by monklet » December 12th, 2011, 1:41 pm

Fieldnotes wrote:Brad you might be "jumping-the-gun." :shock: The Long-nosed Leopard is widespread in Frazier, Lockwood Valley, and Cuyama Valley area. Blunt-nosed Leopard hybrids are in Cuyama Valley. Desert Spiny Lizard occur on the maritime drainage of Piru Creek at Hardluck Campground where it associates with coastal herpetofauna. Desert Night Lizards Lockwood Valley and Cuyama Valley. sounds like a nice close place for a field trip. :beer:
For snake's sake, picky picky picky :lol: ...but what do I know, it's not like I wrote a book on this crap er somethin' :D ...but thanks for the update :) Glad you're paying attention Will!

btw, when's the best time to cruise sallies in these parts?
Brad

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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by BlackPearl » December 12th, 2011, 5:11 pm

I've seen several spiny lizards along Piru creek between Pyramid Lake and Lake Piru.

Sorry... No pics though.

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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by Biker Dave » December 13th, 2011, 9:28 pm

Sounds like I need to make a visit to my "home place" of Ventura County (without visiting any family).

Dave

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Fieldnotes
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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by Fieldnotes » December 17th, 2011, 12:37 pm

monklet wrote: btw, when's the best time to cruise sallies in these parts?
Brad
Sorry Brad, somehow I over looked this question. Finding salamanders in Ventura is going to be the same as finding them elsewhere. Be patient and wait for a warm storm when snow levels are over 5000ft or more (obviously the higher elevations are better). As you would drive for snakes, keep to roads that traverse great habitat with little traffic. Keep in mind there are fewer salamander species in Ventura County, so its not going to be as productive as in the mtns of LA county. Rain driving is a great way to find frogs too. However Western Toads and Chorus Frogs are found since the true frogs are now rare. BTW, Slender salamanders are tough to spot on roads and I have never found one by road cruising.

W

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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by Speckled Rosy » December 17th, 2011, 7:15 pm

If I could, I would also like to add the Coastal Rosy Boa to the possible list. I believe they could be found in the east part of the county.

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monklet
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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by monklet » December 18th, 2011, 8:56 am

Fieldnotes wrote:
monklet wrote: btw, when's the best time to cruise sallies in these parts?
Brad
Sorry Brad, somehow I over looked this question. Finding salamanders in Ventura is going to be the same as finding them elsewhere. Be patient and wait for a warm storm when snow levels are over 5000ft or more (obviously the higher elevations are better). As you would drive for snakes, keep to roads that traverse great habitat with little traffic. Keep in mind there are fewer salamander species in Ventura County, so its not going to be as productive as in the mtns of LA county. Rain driving is a great way to find frogs too. However Western Toads and Chorus Frogs are found since the true frogs are now rare. BTW, Slender salamanders are tough to spot on roads and I have never found one by road cruising.

W
Thanks Will :) ...so I'll probably have to wait and hope for a March storm ...or will they be out in January if the storm is not too cold? I know a road on the north side of a ridge separating Ojai from the coast. It is heavily wooded with Oak and Black Walnut and I suspect it might produce well for Arboreals and Ensatina???

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Fieldnotes
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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by Fieldnotes » December 18th, 2011, 12:39 pm

Woodlands with much leaf litter are nice areas for Ensatina and Arboreals; stick to coastal zones. January is okay as long as temperatures are 50's or more. I prefer Feb. to find the simple salamanders like Arboreals and Ensatinas. When the rain is actually gently falling or very soon after is best. Note, I have never road cruised Ventura and don’t think that I would road cruise there since, Ensatinas are easier to flip and that oak woodland that you mentioned sounds like a good place to investigate for Arboreals during some rain. Newts are common when night driving, but Ventura Mountains do not have many locations for them. Perhaps the Santa Monica Mtns are better to night drive than the Transverse Range.

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monklet
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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by monklet » December 18th, 2011, 5:12 pm

Are arboreals found by cruising or flipping as you indicated for ensatina? This woodland is probably as shady and rich as any you'd find in SoCal. There's a very lightly traveled asphalt road which runs from an elevation of about 1500 to 2500 feet.

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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by Richard F. Hoyer » December 18th, 2011, 8:22 pm

Jonathan:
Do not know if your data base accepts anecdotal sightings without some type of verification. For what they are worth, here as some of my past observations for Ventura County.

Yellow-blotched Ensatina: Observed a number of specimens on Alamo Mt. while conducting searches for C. bottae.

Calif. Legless Lizard : In April, 2002, while with Brad Alexander searching for C. bottae on Frazier Mt., at lower elevation on the west side, Brad uncovered a legless lizard.

Rubber Boa: I believe there is one voucher specimen from Alamo Mt. in one of the institutional collections. In April 2002, I found an adult male Rubber Boa on Frazier Mt. when with Brad Alexander. I donated the specimen to CAS. Just this past summer, a second Rubber Boa was found (subadult female) by a herper on Frazier Mt. and sent to me. It is currently under brumation conditions here in Corvallis.

Calif. Mt. Kingsnake: Observed one specimens on Alamo Mt.

Richard F. Hoyer (Corvallis, Oregon)

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jonathan
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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by jonathan » December 18th, 2011, 8:40 pm

Oh, it's definitely not "my" database - I'm just another NAFHA member helping to promote it.

You can definitely enter any records you want into it - though starting next year Latitude/Longitude data will be required for each entry (though there's an easy-to-use map tool in the database if you don't have L/L coordinates but can find it on a map). Photo-vouchers, audio recording vouchers, and official collection #'s are all accepted. You can also enter a record without any kind of voucher, but many of the data requesters won't accept unvouchered data.

Just go to www.naherp.com if you want to enter data. Brian Hubbs wrote how-to instructions for people new to entering data at viewtopic.php?f=12&t=3679.

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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by Fieldnotes » December 18th, 2011, 10:57 pm

Brad, the location and elevation sound awesome. Both species can be found on roads, but the Ensatina is more common. Flipping is tough when searching for Arboreals and far more Arboreals can be spotted by shinning oaks and rock faces at night in rainy weather.

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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by Fundad » December 19th, 2011, 11:19 am

Brad, the location and elevation sound awesome. Both species can be found on roads, but the Ensatina is more common. Flipping is tough when searching for Arboreals and far more Arboreals can be spotted by shinning oaks and rock faces at night in rainy weather.
If its better than flipping, then I am going to have try, cause Taylor, Matt, and I flipped 8 in 2 hours in SD county..

Fundad

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Fieldnotes
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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by Fieldnotes » December 20th, 2011, 12:29 am

Fundad wrote: If its better than flipping, then I am going to have try, cause Taylor, Matt, and I flipped 8 in 2 hours in SD county..

Fundad
Eight in 6-man hours, yeah I think you can do better than that.

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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by Taylor Henry » December 20th, 2011, 11:11 am

Fieldnotes wrote:Eight in 6-man hours, yeah I think you can do better than that.
How about 16 in 2-man hours? In any case, I will have to try out the rainy night flashlight method you speak of. Sounds like a pretty neat way to find them!

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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by hellihooks » December 20th, 2011, 1:38 pm

So... you shine one 15 ft up an Oak.... then what? :crazyeyes: :lol: never tried zooming in that far, with the flash on... :roll: jim

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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by Fieldnotes » December 22nd, 2011, 11:28 am

Sounds as though I'm not the only one that likes night hiking for salamanders. I dont know how long it took them to find the 11+ Arboreals, but im sure it didnt take long.

This quote taken form Chad's 2011 post:
Chad M. Lane wrote: A few days later Gary took me out to find some Arboreal Salamanders (Aneides lugubris) in-situ on this neat rock wall. Which had to be one of my favorite nights herping this year it was a blast, not in a car cruising for Salamanders, and not flipping them and having to repose them for photos, we got to watch them without any hands on. It was really cool seeing Arboreals climbing around the rock walls, Enstina walking around the bottom, even seen a Slender Salamander active on the surface. It was just a whole new experience to herping that I really enjoyed very much thanks Gary!

We did end up grabbing this adult male for photos, due to our limitations of getting close enough with our cameras, out of 11+ Arboreal Salamanders we watch this was the only one we laid hands on.

:thumb: :thumb:

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Chad M. Lane
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Re: Ventura County - lots more needed, recent database reque

Post by Chad M. Lane » December 22nd, 2011, 8:11 pm

Half an hour maybe to spot them all, now that I think about it, I believe we counted 13. We spent about 2 hours going from one to the other for photos as our lights, and moving closer to them scared them back into the cracks. Many where to high up to get any photos with 90mm lens on a full frame camera at night too boot!



Cheers,
Chad

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