More observations about permethrin poisoning.

Captive care and husbandry.

Moderator: Scott Waters

Post Reply
User avatar
Don Becker
Posts: 3312
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 4:21 am
Location: Iowa
Contact:

More observations about permethrin poisoning.

Post by Don Becker »

As much as I hate to admit this, I am still apparently battling a mite problem. They originally came in with two sonoran gopher snakes that my brother gave me. When I originally treated the snakes using lice bedding spray, I over did it, and I lost one of the gopher snakes to permethrin poisoning. Due to that, I was hesitant on treating the other snakes fully, and sure enough, a few months later I still found mites again.

I treated everyone this time, spraying down their cages, and letting it dry. Midway through, I stopped to look up other treatments, and found a PDF talking about using Nix diluted in a gallon of water. This seemed safer than using the lice bedding spray (provent a mite is the same stuff), so I changed it over. The next day I was checking on everyone, I noticed the same erratic movements in my smooth green snake, that I had observed in the sonoran gopher before it died. She had been treated with the bedding spray prior to my switching it over. I pulled her out to decide what to do with her, assuming she was about to die, but the seizures stopped. I set her back in her tub, and the seizures started back up. When I picked her back up again, they stopped again. I set her on my desk assuming the permethrin in the tub was causing them, and she started shaking on my desk. I picked her back up, and held her for an hour or so, and she didn't have another seizure. After that time, I set her back on my desk, and within a few minutes, she was having seizures again. I figured my body heat was doing something for her, so I put her on a tub with some paper towel in it, directly on a heating pad. She had no seizures. I kept her in this tub for a day or so, and then placed her back into her enclosure, and she has been fine ever since.

Fast forward to last week. The seizures in the green snake once again scared me away from doing follow up treatments, and mites showed up on a snake. I sprayed down all the cages with a nix solution. No issues. Yesterday, I did a follow up treatment. I pulled each snake out of their tubs one by one, dunked them in a nix mix, sprayed down their cage, and put in paper towels as a bedding. I watched them all night, and going into this morning. No issues popped up. Just a bit ago though, I noticed my smooth earth snake was having seizures. Just like with the smooth green snake, when I pulled it out, it stopped having seizures, and once again, I have the snake in a small tube directly on a heating pad, and the seizures have stopped.

So, if you have the misfortune of having mites, and have the great misfortune of poisoning one of your animals, put them on some heat, it may help them pull through it.
Darkhorse
Posts: 191
Joined: July 8th, 2011, 5:11 pm
Location: Prattville,Alabama

Re: More observations about permethrin poisoning.

Post by Darkhorse »

I have had good success with treating orally with ivermectin. I have no idea of a dose off the top of my head, but I had good success. Daily cage cleaning and proper dosing is the key. I have used this on dragons and corallus species. Topical sprays are unfortunately more caustic than curative in most cases. Sorry to hear of your experience.
Chris
User avatar
Don Becker
Posts: 3312
Joined: June 7th, 2010, 4:21 am
Location: Iowa
Contact:

Re: More observations about permethrin poisoning.

Post by Don Becker »

It would be tough giving a 5" earth snake an oral dosage I imagine. I think the main issue was that when I sprayed the enclosure, the earth snake tends to dig around and rub it's face in the bottom of the tub trying to dig. It had no reaction to just being sprayed down along with the cage the week prior. I hate mites come in on a python from a pet store as a kid. Treatment then was just soaking daily, can cleaning daily for a while. Much easier to do with only a single snake. This is unfortunately my first issue with mites while having a larger collection (around 30 snakes), so it changes things up a bit. All snakes are on news paper right now, and each day, that is getting replaced, and the tubs getting wiped down. The snakes soak while I clean out there tub.
condyle
Posts: 206
Joined: September 25th, 2010, 3:46 pm
Location: Santa Cruz ca

Re: More observations about permethrin poisoning.

Post by condyle »

I "boa sat" for a teacher and imediately infected my Lampro collection of 20 snakes a few years back with mites. I attempted an Herbal remedy I thought would be a better alternative to the pest strips. I wiped down cages and furnishings with Chrysanthemum tea . I'm no herbalist, but I am aware that pyrethins were derived from some Chrysanthemum species and usualy for my own medical needs have better responses from herbs vs what was derived from them. At any rate I soaked all snakes in water as well to drown mites and repeated everything a couple weeks later. In four years since, I have been mite free and snakes are healthy. Not sure if drowning mites alone and simple cleaning would give the same results, but the infection was rather alarming and I would repeat if ever needed.
User avatar
Kelly Mc
Posts: 4529
Joined: October 18th, 2011, 1:03 pm

Re: More observations about permethrin poisoning.

Post by Kelly Mc »

Mites are very fragile organisms. They are also very mobile ones.
Using the fragility and mobility in how we address them is even more effective then which agent of product we choose to use . In mode - the product is secondary, interchangable.

Re infestation , and side effects/overexposure/toxicity - can be reduced and a mite occurance in a collection can be resolved in a single procedure.

For instance - floors . As well as shelves etc. But the floor is important . Spray it . Mop it. Before and after procedure
Post Reply